My welding qoute... (numbers!)

[TechnicalNut]

:| I've just received a quote for the welding on our camper.

I thought I'd share it with you for two reasons:

1). I'd appreciate peoples feedback, especially on the estimated hours per task.

2). So others can learn about restoration costs. Nobody seems to post this info.

Bus History:
The bus was a rust free Californian import in 2000. It's been dry stored for the last two. It's done approx. 10,000 miles since being registered. Originally I thought it needed a rear corner and battery tray. :roll: After lots of paint removal, it appears to require all the usual stuff, arches, sills, lower windscreen support, etc. I'd say it's in a pretty good state compared to many I've seen.

The quote is broken down into two sections, welding and making-good (prep, etch & fill the repaired areas).

Welding: Labour 36 hours @ £30.00 £1,080.00
Make-good: Labour 6 hours @ £30.00 £180.00 (Materials £55)
Total (inc.vat): £1,512.25

Plus, I've priced-up about £400 in repair panels.
All in all, it's going to cost about £2,000, and I'll have a solid shell. :shock: :shock: :!:

I've considered the DIY route, and I don't think the savings will be all that great - when you add up welder, wire, gas, helmet, fuel costs (it's stored 100+ miles from my home!), etc. Plus the time involved in me doing the job. :?

I'd appreciate peoples thoughts, as it's an awful lot of money to source, never mind spend!

The breakdown (some of it):
outer sills, 1.5h
offside rear corner 3h
battery tray 3h (!!)
lower section of side panel 3h
inner & outer lower front panel 3h
lower windscreen support 2h
side window supports 2h
repair old camping accessory holes 2h
front arches ?h
inner rear wheel arches ?h
front seatbelt mounts ?h
one rear seat belt mount ?h


If you got this far , thanks for your time!

 

[sparkywig]

I think that's a fairly reasonable quote for the work involved.

 

[mcvw]

Hi,

Your bus almost has a twin - here's our 68 deluxe (twin slider) 8)

Although I'd much prefer to have your repair bill as the estimate we've received for getting our bus back to a solid shell is almost double your total spend - plus parts (approx £850) - so we're looking at nearer to £4k (think it's 100 hours + sundries).

If you like I can list the panels that as per our estimate need replacing/repairing - it's a long list, and might actually make you feel a lot better about your bus

Cheers,


Mike

 

[TechnicalNut]

BayTripper, I'd appreciate that list - just to see what other locations I should be checking for rust. :|
If we decide to go ahead with the quote, it should all be completed by May. I've a few weeks to discover any other hidden issues. ...and start collecting the panels.

Are JK, Heritage and the majority of Schofields panels from the same supplier? I have a feeling that Heritage win on panels, is this right?


Annoyingly, some of the repairs required are to rectify a lousy LHD to RHD conversion. I wish it was left at LHD, no two ways about it!


Here's how she looked before I took it off the road:

It's comforting to read your comments, thanks folks.

Phil & Sophie.

 

[Araon]

who did the conversion?

 

[TechnicalNut]

Subject: My welding qoute... (numbers!)

who did the conversion?

I don't wish to name bash, as I don't have all the facts. But...

I bought the bus in 2000, sold it to a friend in 2003 and bought it back in 2005. Whilst my friend had it, he had it lowered, fitted brms and converted to RHD. A RHD used to add 25% to the value, plus the lowering job and alloys - so I paid a pretty sum extra to buy it back, compared to the value I sold it at.

The conversion was done by himself and a friend who runs a acvw resto company located in south Manchester. The welding IMO is poor. Un-intentionally, the job was done to the lowest standard possible to pass the MOT and make it work (again, IMO).

One example being....
I was surprised how vague the steering was when I got it back off my friend. The reason turned out to be due to the steering box bolts having sheered off! (they hadn't braced the inside of the box section, so the box section was 'crushed' and allowed the bolts to work loose/sheer)!. 'Luckily', the wiring loom was yanked over from left to right and held there by zip tie :shock: , which kept the remaining bolt in place! :roll:

Example two...
The clutch arm is welded to the chassis, and sits about 1cm off the chassis! :!:

Anyway, it's all being re-done. Bloody annoying to have paid thru the nose for it (in the purchase), and having to pay for it to be re-done safely & properly!

I actually preferred it LHD to be honest! It's not like you can swap the sliding door over to do a full job, is it!?

Phil & Sophie.

 

[mcvw]

Make sure you're sitting down... Right, here goes...

osf wheel arch 68.94
osf seat belt mount 17.95
osf inner wheel arch 15.5
osf b-post 17.94
osf cab floor 32.5
osf outrigger/j-point 39.95
os middle outrigger 22.95
osr outrigger 11.5
os inner sill 23.95
os middle sill 46.49
os outer sill 14.95
osr window lip repair 5
osr wheel arch 23.95
osr arch repair - front 11.5
osr arch repair - rear 11.5
osr lower corner 22.95
osr battery tray 19.5
nsr lower corner 22.95
nsr wheel arch 23.95
nsr arch repair - front 11.5
nsr arch repair - rear 11.5
ns inner sill 23.95
ns middle sill 46.49
ns outer sill 14.95
nsr outrigger 11.5
ns middle outrigger 22.95
nsf outrigger/j-point 39.95
nsf wheel arch 68.95
nsf inner wheel arch 15.5
nsf lower tub repair 23.95
nsf bulkhead repair 5
nsf cab floor 32.5
nsf b-post 15.5
windscreen lip repair 5
nsf seat belt mount 17.95
ns sliding door lower repair 15.5
crossmember front 23.95
crossmember rear 23.95

Total 884.46

The above is a complete list, and may reduce if repairs are performed rather than replacing a whole panel. It may also reduce if a panel is not required i.e. inner/middle sills. The adverse of this is that costs may increase if I opt for front "cuts" rather than repro i.e. front wheel arches etc

I'd also be interested in what people think (hour's wise) for completing all the above

Cheers,


Mike

 

[chippi]

It all sounds pretty reasonable to me, and i firmly believe that in most cases you get what you pay for, if moneys tight you could get say two thirds of it done properly and tackle the rest yourself, rather than all of it done on the cheap, if you catch my drift

 

[james_stan]

Sounds very fair, 30 quid an hour is relatively low and I wouldn't question the
timings. A lot of the repro panels are poor fit and need some fettling.

Personally I would go for it, But be aware the price is more likely to go higher than lower.

Good luck

James

 

[wilgartw]

The conversion was done by himself and a friend who runs a acvw resto company located in south Manchester. The welding IMO is poor. Un-intentionally, the job was done to the lowest standard possible to pass the MOT and make it work (again, IMO).

I had dealing with a aircooled company based in south manchester, never again. unlike you i am willing to bash. had a summer of nothing but problems due to him. i eventually went to stef at "manchester aircooled" and never looked back.

 

[james_stan]

Make sure you're sitting down... Right, here goes...

osf wheel arch 68.94
osf seat belt mount 17.95
osf inner wheel arch 15.5
osf b-post 17.94
osf cab floor 32.5
osf outrigger/j-point 39.95
os middle outrigger 22.95
osr outrigger 11.5
os inner sill 23.95
os middle sill 46.49
os outer sill 14.95
osr window lip repair 5
osr wheel arch 23.95
osr arch repair - front 11.5
osr arch repair - rear 11.5
osr lower corner 22.95
osr battery tray 19.5
nsr lower corner 22.95
nsr wheel arch 23.95
nsr arch repair - front 11.5
nsr arch repair - rear 11.5
ns inner sill 23.95
ns middle sill 46.49
ns outer sill 14.95
nsr outrigger 11.5
ns middle outrigger 22.95
nsf outrigger/j-point 39.95
nsf wheel arch 68.95
nsf inner wheel arch 15.5
nsf lower tub repair 23.95
nsf bulkhead repair 5
nsf cab floor 32.5
nsf b-post 15.5
windscreen lip repair 5
nsf seat belt mount 17.95
ns sliding door lower repair 15.5
crossmember front 23.95
crossmember rear 23.95

Total 884.46

The above is a complete list, and may reduce if repairs are performed rather than replacing a whole panel. It may also reduce if a panel is not required i.e. inner/middle sills. The adverse of this is that costs may increase if I opt for front "cuts" rather than repro i.e. front wheel arches etc

I'd also be interested in what people think (hour's wise) for completing all the above

Cheers,


Mike

That lot in 100 hours seems pretty ambitious - if you look at some of the restos done by the 'pro-ams' on here I suspect they would be pretty please to get all that done. Book it it quick before he changes his mind.

Having said that if you're a pro with all the tools, knowledge and confidence then why not ? I spend a lot of time stroking my chin and wonder how the feck I'm going to do summat then even more time scrambling around in the dust and sh!t trying to do it. The pros will get it on the ramp have all the air tools cutters grinders etc to get it done quickly.

sorry for the meaningless ramble

James

 

[Guest]

Like eveyone says it looks pretty cheap to be honest and get it booked. But i would stipulate to him is, that he stops if he runs over time and/or budget then you can discuss the rest of the work to complete the job, therefore you dont get stung with another wad of dosh that maybe you havent budgeted for. No surprises. I've had several professional restos and they all went over between £500-1000.

 

[TechnicalNut]

BayTripper listed his entire to-do list and estimated approx. 100 hours.
Mine is very similar except it excludes any chassis work (so far!).

I watched a 1991 VHS (remember those?) last night. It's a demo video that the welding-chap put together. He was working on some vintage jags and mercs. He'd made up many of the panels and arches and seemed a dab hand at leading/soldering to. I was quite impressed - but I have to remember this was 18 years ago! He's a father & son setup, working out of a 6-8 car garage by their house! He mainly does insurance jobs, not resto's these days.

Anyhow, I'm going to call him and give it the green light. He was talking about booking it in for the 4 days after Easter Monday - an in and out job. Hooray!

To lower my paranoia levels for bad workmen/rip-off types, I'll list all the work required and agree he does no more than agreed.
I'm soo revved up about this now! I could be back on the road this summer!

Anyone advise on which company provides the better replacement panels?

Thanks to everyone and good luck on your resto BayTripper!

Phil & Sophie.

 

[Bin jammin]

I would say that's a very optimistic quote on time for that list of jobs and £30 per hour is very cheap for restoration work, i can't imagine how they will be able to stick to that pricing.

Also is this actually a quote or is it an estimate they are very different things, and i don't know anyone (who knows what they are doing) who will give a quote on restorations. It's too much of an unknown quantity to be able to say for sure exactly what you will need to do work wise on one of these.

Good luck with it, keep us all posted on the progress.

 

[Bin jammin]

Ps it is unfortunately just a cas of phoning around to see whos got genuine panels in stock, you should try Just Kampers, VW Heritage and Alan Schofield between them you should be able to get a full set of genuine panels. It's pointless buying repros they are very rubish and half the thickness.

 

[T2-Nate]

All I can add to this is:
Buy a cheap 2nd hand welder and have a go at it yourself.
Have the whole bus mediablasted except for the straight panels, and buy all panels and have them blasted too (black primer is a no-no) and take some welding lessons from a pro (a few around here by now )
Replacing the whole floor is easier than trying to keep some parts because you want to save time (you won't).
It's not hard, I used to know buttkiss about bodywork, I'm at it now for 2 years and I've learned so much and gained amazing amounts of confidence. That alone is worth it.

Just Do It
:mrgreen:

P.S.: the welding quote is very reasonable.

 

[mcvw]

Quick update... I found my original quote/estimate, and it's 124 hours - not 100 hours.

Does that make the amount-of-work to hours ratio less ambitious - and therefore more realistic?

 

[Frankie]

Mate I'm no welder but I have just started to do my own outside in the open air and to be honest with you, once you look through loads of threads and watch what others have done and you start to recognise what things are and what they are called cutting into your van is not that scary you know what to expect and if you get stuck come here and the solution is on here or ask the most difficult bit for me is, was ,the welding just because I didn't know how to set the dame thing ,but now its not 100% but its 100% better than it was so consider doing it yourself you will get great satisfaction out of it and save a fortune, good luck Frankie.

 

[Bin jammin]

Quick update... I found my original quote/estimate, and it's 124 hours - not 100 hours.

Does that make the amount-of-work to hours ratio less ambitious - and therefore more realistic?

124 hours at his rate of £30 per hour = £3720 in labour which i would say is more like it, but £30ph is very cheap if it comes in at that you've done very well! I guess their overheads are low.
I notice your list says outer sills, usually if the outers are shot, so are the inners, and usually the bit behind the front wheels above the jacking point around the "B" pillar.
Also you list inner rear wheel arches, i presume the outers are going to be removed then to be able to replace the inners is that in the price?

 

[TechnicalNut]

Baydreamer was quoted 124 hours for his twin sliding door 68. I don't think he mentioned at what rate though.

For the work mine requires, I was told 36 hours @ £30 per hour. (I originally got a quote from this chap (KN) before December - he now charges £35 per hour, but said he'd honour the original £30ph for me). (Phew! £180 saved! )

I've been toying with the idea of doing the welding myself, but the bus is about 150 miles from my house! :shock: (It's a £35 fuel bill each round trip!)

I made the decision to go ahead with the quote... (sorry: ESTIMATE), and called KN earlier - agreed on some terms and the deal is struck. I'll trailer it in on Easter Monday, and if all goes to plan, I'll take it away the following weekend, "In & out"!

Between then and now, I've an long block to build-up, the chassis to media blast and paint, and an awful lot of shopping for panels and other stuff to do - hoorah! ...I'll also do some more rust hunting on the underside - wish me luck.

Thanks everyone!