So tell me about 1600 Twin Port?

[bermuda blue]

I'm used to basic flat four , so what is this twin port about :? (good/bad/ugly)?.

Cheers -JIM.

 

[Tofufi]

Twinport is any VW engine built after 1970 model year (so August '70 onwards engines were twinport) excluding the 1200 engines in beetles.

It is just a slightly more efficient cylinder head design, with the 3 piece manifold instead of the earlier one piece design.

Singleport heads are slightly more robust, but are not as free flowing as the twin port heads, meaning single port engines have slightly more torque low down, but less power and a lower max BHP figure. The twinport engines also had a slightly improved ('doghouse') cooler to try to remove the problem of cylinder #3 tending to run marginally hotter than the others, with a larger fan and a few other bits and pieces.

 

[bermuda blue]

Nice one, impressed, thank's a lot - sounds OK then
Cheers Mate.........-JIM.

 

[bermuda blue]

Would anyone have a photo of a tidy one - ie: what it should look like :shock: .

Cheers -JIM.

 

[Tofufi]

This is my engine...

I don't claim it is perfect, but it has all the bits VW made it with (and the gold tinware was not my choice!).

Things like the standard air filter connected and working properly (on a single carb this is vital), the small plastic clips to hold the HT leads and fuel line in the fanhousing, and the original style vacuum advance distributor all make it drive as VW intended.

 

[bermuda blue]

Good on you mate - just what I needed, I'm looking at one (via photo) that just did'nt look right, now I know why..........Thank's very much....JIM.

 

[Tofufi]

What looked wrong about it?

It may have been given twin carbs or anything else, and in those cases the stock air filter isn't needed (short manifolds don't need the hot air feed to the air filter).

Can you post the pic on here?

If you're looking to buy a bus, worry more about the bodywork, paint and any rust issues the vehicle may have, before worrying about the engine. Stock air filters can be had for £20, complete brand new reconditioned engines for around £1k or good 1600 used engines for £200-£400. Compare those costs to the money that a respray will cost you, or extensive welding, and the engine condition will suddenly not be too important

 

[bermuda blue]

Funny enough the van itself seems OK (resprayed), the cab looks tidy and
while the inside rear area looks a tired Westy - I don't mind as I want to do
a personal makeover. I feel good about everything but the engine.

It seems like a straight-forward 1600 Twin Port (but a bit scruffy) with a single (standard?) carburetter but on looking closely there is very basic filter mounted directly on top - no duct to the usual box of trick's. The two
'hoses' that come from the fan housing and turn down through the floor are missing (blanked off at the housing).

It appears to be running OK but why is it not rigged as it should be - suggest's to me there is an underlying problem that this set up is designed to get round . If those hoses are part of the heat /air system on an air-cooled motor then they should be there as intended - and the filter thats air too.
Yes the missing bit's are cheap/easy -so why ain't they there :? .

Your advice much appreciated....JIM.

 

[Tofufi]

Many people don't bother with the heating system, and fitting 'pancake' style air filters is in fashion in the name of performance. Except they don't help, even in weather warm enough to avoid the problems of carb icing.

If the heating tubes are missing, but the holes have not been blanked off in the tinware, chances are the engine will have been running a little hot. But again, engines are cheap compared to rust repair or bodywork. So judge the van based on the quality of the body, and check for filler. It is easy to disguise a rotten bus with a load of filler and a shiny coat of paint, but it will deteriorate very quickly!

 

[Graham L]

It is easy to disguise a rotten bus with a load of filler and a shiny coat of paint, but it will deteriorate very quickly!

Wise words for one so young Jim!!

But he is right, I think I know which van you are talking about, blanked off tinware is a way to get more cooling onto the engine but as Jim has stated could just be because there is no heating fitted. Replacing the pancake air filter with a standard one and putting the cooling pipes back in is not difficult, new pipes are less than a tenner and an airbox can be picked up at most swapmeets or via a wanted ad on here.

 

[bermuda blue]

Once again I owe you thank's - you are a gent to volunteer advice.
Funny how something like this can jaundice your feel for purchase,it
would be easy to estimate the cost of reinstating the missing bit's -
but less so in term's of any other problem's caused by having been
running hot for how long?. Probably safe to assume the heat exchanger section's are shot through which is why they are not connected?.
Guees it now hinges on what "or near offer" they will accept :?: .

Thank's again ...JIM.

 

[Graham L]

Jim

Not being funny but ask why the heater feeds are blanked off and check whether it has heat exchangers fitted to it and not J Tubes (by pass pipes)

 

[bermuda blue]

Absolutely my intention, this thread was my homework beforehand -and
has been very usefull, it's pretty much a day trip to view in the flesh hence
the preparation. Cheers ....JIM.

 

[Tofufi]

It is easy to disguise a rotten bus with a load of filler and a shiny coat of paint, but it will deteriorate very quickly!

Wise words for one so young Jim!!

Why thank you

I do think it reflects partly on the type of use people give a vehicle as to whether they use things like the heating... for me, it is a must. But then my bus is driven in any weather, throughout the year as it is my only road legal vehicle. So function is all that matters to me at the moment (and on my bus, it shows :lol: )

If it a shiny bus only driven in good weather, or a bus with a larger engine then the owners might not feel the stock heating is worth bothering with.

(another) Jim.

 

[Tofufi]

If it a shiny bus only driven in good weather, or a bus with a larger engine then the owners might not feel the stock heating is worth bothering with.

Having said this, just to elaborate further... if the owner has just ripped off the pipes between the fanhousing and heat exchangers, leaving huge holes through the tinware, I'd have to worry what other parts of the vehicle they have neglected or done poor jobs on.

If it looked like they understood the purpose of the tin, and did a thorough job of disconnecting the associated heating to ensure everything worked well, I'd not have those reservations

Jim.

 

[Air Cooled Rookie]

Does disconnecting the air pipes from the dog house to the heat exchangers really make THAT much difference to the cooling?

Just wondered as my heating is perminantly on due to the flaps in the heat exchangers not working.

 

[Tofufi]

Does disconnecting the air pipes from the dog house to the heat exchangers really make THAT much difference to the cooling?

Just wondered as my heating is perminantly on due to the flaps in the heat exchangers not working.

Yes.

You will get hot air rising from your exhaust and heat exchangers (which are designed to flow/conduct heat into them from the exhaust side) into the engine bay, and air cooled engines need a cool engine bay - hence all the tinware and seals around the engine to separate the hot and cold zones.

Secondly, not capping them off at the fanshroud end means more air can escape through them than with the heating system connected. Jake Raby in the US did a test and suggested drilling a 1/2" hole in each capped off heat outlet on the fanshroud gave the simulation of the backpressure of a heat exchanger.

Thirdly, the heat exchangers ALWAYS have air flowing through them, even if the heating is off (the air vents from the heat exchanger tops when it is not going into the cab). This means they actually do remove some heat from the heads through the exchangers.

If you need to disconnect your heating, crawl under the bus and remove the large plastic air tubes between the heat exchangers and the body of the van, NOT the ones in the engine bay.

8)

Jim.

 

[Air Cooled Rookie]

Hi Jim, Sorry, I didn't explain myself very well.

I completely agree that leaving the hoses off the dog house and doing nothing else will be detrimental (to say the least) to the cooling.

My question was that if you remove the hose from the dog house to the heat exchangers and cap off the open ends, would that cause problems with the cooling, as I was considering this as like I said, my heat exchangers are always open and it gets hot in the cab during the summer.

However, you answered that question anyway! I didn't realise that the heat exchangers still allowed air flow across them when thier flaps were closed.

Going back (kind of) to the original thread, Burmuda Blue - I had to replace all the standard air filter, thermostatic air intake flap, etc as well as the cooling flaps/thermaotat on my van after I bought it. As others said, you can pick all this stuff up fairly cheaply - I used Mega Bug who gave excellent service - but be aware that the little vacuum valve in the top of the standard oil bath air filter if often broken/missing and can be quite expensive.

If you do end up buying a 2nd hand standard air filterm it'd be worth making sure that the valve is present. From the outside of the filter it just looks like two small bore stub pipes sticking out of the top of the filter.

 

[bermuda blue]

Cheers chap's - and guess what I've talked myself out of that one (too many issue's :msn4: ) - I'm onto a much better option for around the same price.
But thank you it has been usefull. Cheers -JIM.
PS: See my other Bumper query.