No gas mig welders

[wanderlust]

Have thought about getting a cheap welder and having a practice so i can do my sills. Have seen some no gas mig welders for around £100 anyone used these?

 

[junkyardjim]

Hi wanderlust,

I have briefly used a gasless mig a while ago (did my apprentiship as a fabicator/welder)
wasnt that impressed TBH.

Basicaly gasless migs use a type off 'flux' on the wire (which is also more expensive) instead of gas
this tends to spatter more than gas and does not give such a neat weld.

I would say gasless are ok for occasional small area light work, But i would pay the extra for a gas one
especially if your learnng

Cheers

 

[Rusty Lee]

dude dont touch it save a little more and get a good one.you will never lose much buying a mig because everyone wants single phase (240v) migs so you get one at the right price and your laughing.honestly mate i got 2 migs and am always looking out for second hand ones to come along as i have loads of mates looking for them.

 

[young_dubya]

Cant stress enough how much easier it is to weld with a quality welder. we had a £100 welder and it was bobbins! Thought it was just me but when i used the more quality welders at college my welding was 10x better! The one we have was £300 off ebay and should have been £450 i think but its soooooo easy to set up and thats were the difficulty is with the cheaper ones.

 

[Hilly_70]

Same advise here ..

Unless your only gonna use it once ( and lets face it , not a chance with a bus! ..)

Gas MIG all the way .. the machine mart TE ones are good for the money ..

Hilly

 

[lard]

Loving this thread and the voices of experience - want to learn welding and thinking of looking out for some kit, based on this I'll take the advise, go on a course and save up some cash as I had been looking at the cheaper end - will also need to by a "project car" to practise on - o.k....it's an excuse to buy a bug as I have a yearning since getting my first aircooled for another one :lol:

 

[Guest]

all good advice, you could look here for a secondhand one,

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

great site for all things welding.

i bought a Portamig 185amp from 'weldequip' who now has an online shop. hes a good bloke and will answer all your questions and his advice is spot on. it wasnt a cheap welder but it does a brilliant job even with my **** skills. My advice is make sure you get a Mig that can go down to 30 amps or less anything above 40 amps will invariably blow holes in your sheet metal especially if you are a novice. Duty cycle is important too, cheap MIGs with a low duty cycle will have you stopping after a few mins continious welding and waiting till the unit cools down (can take 30 mins).

i spent £100 on a course, tbh it was a waste of money, you will learn more by reading (check out that forum) then get yourself some scrap metal and play around.

There's a thread about cheapgas as well im not sure if the deal is still running, it was linked from VZI i got two mid sizes bottles of argoshield from BOC for £35 and the rent was greatly reduced.

 

[froggy]

all good advice, you could look here for a secondhand one,

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

great site for all things welding.

i bought a Portamig 185amp from 'weldequip' who now has an online shop. hes a good bloke and will answer all your questions and his advice is spot on. it wasnt a cheap welder but it does a brilliant job even with my **** skills. My advice is make sure you get a Mig that can go down to 30 amps or less anything above 40 amps will invariably blow holes in your sheet metal especially if you are a novice. Duty cycle is important too, cheap MIGs with a low duty cycle will have you stopping after a few mins continious welding and waiting till the unit cools down (can take 30 mins).

i spent £100 on a course, tbh it was a waste of money, you will learn more by reading (check out that forum) then get yourself some scrap metal and play around.

There's a thread about cheapgas as well im not sure if the deal is still running, it was linked from VZI i got two mid sizes bottles of argoshield from BOC for £35 and the rent was greatly reduced.

I bought my clarke 135A off of weldequip, cheaper than MachineMart (including the postage) after playing around with a cheap mig (Wolf) and the difference is amazing. Thought about gasless but to be honest its not worth it.
The only thing about a college course is they dont teach you how to weld when lying down, upside down, bent around chassis legs, reaching into wheel wells, underneath the battery trays etc etc (you get the idea :lol: )

 

[Guest]

The only thing about a college course is they dont teach you how to weld when lying down, upside down, bent around chassis legs, reaching into wheel wells, underneath the battery trays etc etc (you get the idea :lol: )

very true, i spent each weak welding thicker and thicker bits of metal which got really boring, i was basically left too it. As i had the gas and welder at home i just asked if i could take some of the waste to practice on. i emptied a complete bin full of decent sized cuts and different thicknesses, the dude didn't care so i have enough metal to build half a bus now lol. well i did think i might as well get my moneys worth...

i did get a chance to mess around with tig, my Dad served his time on tig and mig, welding aircraft aluminium but the bugger wont help me at all

 

[ProfessorWheeto]

You could always buy second hand,
at college the first years can't understand why I always go for the only old ropey beaten up welder (Butters) whilst they go for the big shiny new looking ones (sealey supermig) I'd rather have a good quality ancient welder than a new cheapo one.

 

[ProfessorWheeto]

The only thing about a college course is they dont teach you how to weld when lying down, upside down, bent around chassis legs, reaching into wheel wells, underneath the battery trays etc etc (you get the idea :lol: )

very true, i spent each weak welding thicker and thicker bits of metal which got really boring, i was basically left too it. As i had the gas and welder at home i just asked if i could take some of the waste to practice on. i emptied a complete bin full of decent sized cuts and different thicknesses, the dude didn't care so i have enough metal to build half a bus now lol. well i did think i might as well get my moneys worth...

Out of interest what courses did you guys do?

I'm in my last year of my apprentiship (NVQ Lv3 Vehicle Body Repair) and I'll hopefully be getting onto a evening course as well (City and Guilds 3268 Introduction to welding) Granted the MIG stuff I'll have to just sit through but might get some different tips as its taught by the welding and engineering guys rather then my vehicle body tutor. But really its for the TIG and MMA experience.

 

[young_dubya]

Ive not had courses a few mates of mine did them and it helped abit but not as much as hoped. practice is the key. I think the courses are a good idea but they are aimed at welders. The see it as if you can weld thin stuff you can weld thick stuff. I started on thin sheet for the VW's and then went on to thick. the thick stuff gives you the ability to practice technuique which makes welding the thin stuff easier so IMHO, starting again id start there :lol:

Practice runs both consistant (i loop from top to bottom imagine joining "O's" with straight lines at the top ) I very rarely use this as it causes alot of heat in one spot and thats when things warp. Its good for things like chassis members and out riggers etc where the metal has enough thickness to prevent the warping. Still though a run of about 1" is a maximum anywhere on a car for me. (Unless its things like main chassis members which need a good strong weld)

Then practice doing the same with tack type welds (do one spot weld for a second or so then pull off allowing it to cool, just before the orange glow disapears do another one overlaping it (like audi badges)) I use this for runs on the thinner stuff but a 1cm or so run is maximum for me.

Then theres the welding by numbers. I use this on things like body work where a warped panel can be easily achieved with a tad to much heat. Getting the welder set right is imperative for good penatration and quick spots. You dont want to be welding things twice if you can help it. Start by tacking the panel in 1" gaps all the way along working from one end to the other to avoid stresses building up along the length. Then work from each tack to its left or right then move about the panel to stop heat building up. Most welding sights will show you profiles of welds and whats perfect and what to adjust to get the set up perfect. Alwasy practice before starting on your car as being rusty ruins panels. Welding upside down Wire speed up a touch.

The main trouble i have is grinding afterwards i always tend to take too much off :lol: :lol:

Slowly slowly catchy monkey.

Ps. CLEAN EVERWHERE!! Bright shiny metal (both sides!!) Will stop you blowing holes!! V important!

As you were.

 

[Guest]

the course i did was 'an introduction to welding', 10 week beginner/hobbyist course that led on to an NVQ, run by the local education authority. it wasnt much help.

 

[dandaz]

Ive not had courses a few mates of mine did them and it helped abit but not as much as hoped. practice is the key. I think the courses are a good idea but they are aimed at welders. The see it as if you can weld thin stuff you can weld thick stuff. I started on thin sheet for the VW's and then went on to thick. the thick stuff gives you the ability to practice technuique which makes welding the thin stuff easier so IMHO, starting again id start there :lol:

Practice runs both consistant (i loop from top to bottom imagine joining "O's" with straight lines at the top ) I very rarely use this as it causes alot of heat in one spot and thats when things warp. Its good for things like chassis members and out riggers etc where the metal has enough thickness to prevent the warping. Still though a run of about 1" is a maximum anywhere on a car for me. (Unless its things like main chassis members which need a good strong weld)

Then practice doing the same with tack type welds (do one spot weld for a second or so then pull off allowing it to cool, just before the orange glow disapears do another one overlaping it (like audi badges)) I use this for runs on the thinner stuff but a 1cm or so run is maximum for me.

Then theres the welding by numbers. I use this on things like body work where a warped panel can be easily achieved with a tad to much heat. Getting the welder set right is imperative for good penatration and quick spots. You dont want to be welding things twice if you can help it. Start by tacking the panel in 1" gaps all the way along working from one end to the other to avoid stresses building up along the length. Then work from each tack to its left or right then move about the panel to stop heat building up. Most welding sights will show you profiles of welds and whats perfect and what to adjust to get the set up perfect. Alwasy practice before starting on your car as being rusty ruins panels. Welding upside down Wire speed up a touch.

The main trouble i have is grinding afterwards i always tend to take too much off :lol: :lol:

Slowly slowly catchy monkey.

Ps. CLEAN EVERWHERE!! Bright shiny metal (both sides!!) Will stop you blowing holes!! V important!

As you were.

Even welding is getting complicated now ,I just point and hope for the best.....

no gas no good.... 8)

 

[ProfessorWheeto]

the course i did was 'an introduction to welding', 10 week beginner/hobbyist course that led on to an NVQ, run by the local education authority. it wasnt much help.

Oh, was it just a MIG course then?

 

[Guest]

the course i did was 'an introduction to welding', 10 week beginner/hobbyist course that led on to an NVQ, run by the local education authority. it wasnt much help.

Oh, was it just a MIG course then?

nope it was all kinds of welding brazing gas, MMA, TIG MIG etc. you could chose what you wanted to do and were left to it.

 

[chippi]

I think most angles have been covered here allready, i did city and guilds 1-3 back around 1990 in body repair (man that makes me sound like an old git) and had some good teachers back then, one tip i did learn was to "listen" to the weld, a good weld should sound like a "controlled fart !" one of my tutors would say. A popping and spitting sound would indicate too much wire speed and a fizzing sound would indicate too little wire speed, once you get used to it you will see what i mean , basically you can almost hear a good weld being laid down .

 

[Frankie]

can you use flux core wire with a gas welder and if so to what effect cheers Frankie.

 

[ProfessorWheeto]

the course i did was 'an introduction to welding', 10 week beginner/hobbyist course that led on to an NVQ, run by the local education authority. it wasnt much help.

Oh, was it just a MIG course then?

nope it was all kinds of welding brazing gas, MMA, TIG MIG etc. you could chose what you wanted to do and were left to it.

Oh right, decent course just naff tutors then

Been pricing up a AC/DC TIG for doing alloys and stainless at work... :shock: and people think MIGs are dear!

 

[ProfessorWheeto]

can you use flux core wire with a gas welder and if so to what effect cheers Frankie.

And run it without the gas? I'm guessing it'd weld like a ****** gasless welder?