adjustable front beam

[six]

hey all

I have just bought a early bay, it cam with an adjustable front beam. I think im missing something, as its not adjusting.

What is the correct way to adjust them. its got a single adjuster on the upper beam, if i undo this, then let the bus down off the jack, the ride height stays the same. i was expecting it to move..

any pointers greatly appreciated..

im new to this so please be gental!

thanks

 

[speedwell68]

hey all

I have just bought a early bay, it cam with an adjustable front beam. I think im missing something, as its not adjusting.

What is the correct way to adjust them. its got a single adjuster on the upper beam, if i undo this, then let the bus down off the jack, the ride height stays the same. i was expecting it to move..

any pointers greatly appreciated..

im new to this so please be gental!

thanks

Can you post a pic?

 

[six]

ill get some happy snaps done in the morning and post

 

[stagger lee]

sounds like a bluebird adjuster, were'nt they a single one on top? which is all wrong i.m.o, anyway. it's probably just needs freeing off?

 

[six]

Pic of the beam looking from the rear of van. Bolt is at the top, its undone presently

 

[RockinKees]

If that bolt is on top, there is nothing left to adjust.
At least to lower the front.

You can get it higher though :?

 

[Loxy]

Also looks to only have the one adjuster in the top tube, typically these are fitted in pairs (one on each tube) which I think will give a better distribution of weight onto the torsion leaves - also I would think your current suspension setup is likely to be softer (at least initially).
However if you are trying to lower it somemore you need to be aware that you are likely to run out of balljoint travel (unless you have dropped spindles) if you go much lower

 

[westy68]

how do .. mine has ajusters top and botterm.. when i undid the top one it spung up the same as ur pic.. try this.. jack the bus up take of both front wheels lossen the ajuster.. get a bloody great bar from the front of the bus and put it across the top of the ball joints so it slids through under the bulk head ( so u can lever the wheels downwards) and give it a bloody good leaver downwards.. dont slip it herts! what ur trying to do is in theary is free the torsion leaves u may find there stuck.. sounds daft but try it.. it may take a few attemps. it worked on mine and since then iv had it up and down with no probs..

hope this made sence??

 

[stagger lee]

rockin's nailed it. you are at maximum lowering adjustment. whoever fitted that is lazy. your bus is still significantly supported by the lower torsion leaves, so the relatively small amount of adjustment you get with the single adjusters is negligable. giving lowering ability not worth bothering with. if you are going to hang for stealing a sheep, take the flippin' flock, yeah.

and simply to re-iterate, best you can do is either fit another adjuster on the bottom, fit a properly adjustable beam or fit raised spindles to gain extra slammage.

 

[six]

currently its stock height! so thats so wrong!

im thinking its now 1 of two things..

1) the leaves are stuck as mentioned
2) the shocks are too big and stopping it actually lowering..

since this is a brand new bus to me, and i've had some time to get my head around it, im gunna look at 2 first. ill take the shocks off and see what happens. if not try 1.

But the overriding feeling here is that i shold run 2 adjusters. very logical really, maybe ill just pull the beam off and start again. any one point me at a good idiots guide or book that covers building beams etc as id like to get up to speed on all this stuff before cutting anything.

thanks

 

[stagger lee]

stock height, thats mental? all i can think is that when the adjuster was fitted they got confused and welded it in the wrong position; they thought the current position would be the highest settign and not the lowest? maybe the beam was upside down, dunno.

usually the block in the middle gets seized and not the leaves. they free inside the tubes and ideally covered in grease. maybe the trailing arms are tight, but again roll on bearings and should be smothered in grease? myself it's what rockin' said.

also the dampers would only restrict the movement if they were bottomed out. you'd know this 'cos you'd have no suspension whatsoever, you'd know. bus dampers are just that; they damp the springyness and don't, shouldn't provide any additional support to the suspension. not like a coil-over strut, yeah?

pm me your email, i'll send you a document i wrote donkeys ago that explains all you need to know about lowering a bus front and back.

to salvage your beam i'd place the top adjuster in the highest position. screw/bolt opposite end to where it is. cut the top tube either side of the adjuster and then weld it in the desired location, beit stock position or slightly lower. this gives you then maximum lowering adjustment for the top tube. get another adjuster and apporpriately position it on the lower tube, so it's synchronised to the top, not the same position, it'll be different. yeah? you now have both tubes synchronised in adjustment. and take it from there.

food for thought; it's a messy, pain in the ass job. and if you haven't the necessary tools; welder (descent), grinder, saws, clamps etc. it's even more of a chore? there's alot of folks making new beams out there that cover every desire really. if affordable you might want to consider one of these. you could probably scrape half the money toward one by not doing yours and selling it for whatever you can get. alot of folks would happily take on your beam if it's solid.

if you fancy the challenge, go for it. it's not difficult, just a mawl of a job.

my tuppence worth.

 

[Clem]

There must be more to this. Someone has gone to the effort of narrowing a beam and then welded in one adjuster which is upside down?
Has it got dropped spindles? They cant have got the relatively simple job of adjuster so wrong, can they?

 

[stagger lee]

ooh, just picked up thats it's narrowed already. o.k, sweet, yeah worth sorting it out. thought is was a stocker :msn4:
only thing i can think is they didn't want to disturb the idler. looks like its the old single adjuster on the beam mystery rearing it's ugly head again. last time i saw anyhitng near to this was back in '92, when scallops were cool and charles n eddie were in the charts.

 

[Loxy]

There must be more to this. Someone has gone to the effort of narrowing a beam and then welded in one adjuster which is upside down?
Has it got dropped spindles? They cant have got the relatively simple job of adjuster so wrong, can they?

Cant be arsed to look under my van at the mo (dying of flu (swine?) ) but I do recall that my adjuster if set on its minimum drop will foul the gear linkage - looking at the pic above I would say that if set to minimum that wont be far off.

Six - are you sure it doesnt have any drop - a stock height bay is higher than you think
what is your measurement from ground to bottom edge of front arch (through the centre of the wheel) when sitting on the ground?

 

[Loxy]

Or use the heights on here as a guide:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/68bus/page47.jpg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[six]

Six - are you sure it doesnt have any drop - a stock height bay is higher than you think
what is your measurement from ground to bottom edge of front arch (through the centre of the wheel) when sitting on the ground?

ill get out the guessing stick and take a pic laters and post it etc

yeah this is a mystery, looking at the beam its nicely painted. more akin to a 'production' or bought jobby than a home made one if that makes sence***


***disclaimer there, not saying home made stuff is worse as ive seen lots of production stuff thats rubbish etc.

 

[Araon]

Has that been cut and turned as well?

 

[dubdubz]

.....this gives you then maximum lowering adjustment for the top tube. get another adjuster and apporpriately position it on the lower tube, so it's synchronised to the top, not the same position, it'll be different. yeah? you now have both tubes synchronised in adjustment. and take it from there......

I'm lost on this bit ? could you re-explain it for a [email protected] thought the centre collars held the leaves at the same position [in terms of degrees around the tubes]

are you saying if you looked at the beam end on...so one tube directly above the other.....the bottom middle set screw [for want of a better term] on a stock beam could be at say 7 o'clock and the top tube could be nearer 8 oclock?? or should they both be pointing to the same x'oclock??? is it due to the relationship of trailing arms arc??

could I have a looksee on your 'words', you do come highly recommended from 'punnet'.......... 8)

 

[ground hugger]

.....this gives you then maximum lowering adjustment for the top tube. get another adjuster and apporpriately position it on the lower tube, so it's synchronised to the top, not the same position, it'll be different. yeah? you now have both tubes synchronised in adjustment. and take it from there......

I'm lost on this bit ? could you re-explain it for a [email protected] thought the centre collars held the leaves at the same position [in terms of degrees around the tubes]

are you saying if you looked at the beam end on...so one tube directly above the other.....the bottom middle set screw [for want of a better term] on a stock beam could be at say 7 o'clock and the top tube could be nearer 8 oclock?? or should they both be pointing to the same x'oclock??? is it due to the relationship of trailing arms arc??

could I have a looksee on your 'words', you do come highly recommended from 'punnet'.......... 8)

Yep thats right^^^^the top adjuster on your beam has been fitted about 10mm
offset "Or it looks like it in your pic".Fit one to the bottom and you should be ok.Ive got a template that I used when building my beam up that shows stock holes in the beam.I'll find it out and post it on here so you can check if its been turned.The bottom bolt looks stock

 

[stagger lee]

dubz, specifically my comments related to six's problem. i think his adjuster fitter got confused and fitted it in the wrong position, potentially upside down. so the lowest position is actually the stock, or close to it position.

you are right in what you think. looking side on, on a beam the trailing arms are not 'parallel' want for better words. from memory the top one points more toward the ground than the lower one. this must be so the torsion leaves act against each other and give a stronger/better springyness type thing.

bottom line is, if you are fitting adjusters, cut'n'twist whatever. with the spindles removed and the trailing arms still fitted, but relaxed. mark/punch the beam ends and trailing arms. so when you do whatever in the middle you have a reference as too how it was originally, yeah.

revisiting six's problem. i realised that if the top adjuster is repositioned upside down; i.e. cut the beam either side of the adjuster and flip it 180 degrees. the the leaves will be in the same place, once refitted, but the adjuster bolt/nut will now be at the bottom. allowing the adjustment of the adjuster. or get the beam/arm position of a std beam and start from scratch again.

hope this makes sense and is of some use?