Clutch release bearing?

[admwllms]

Just got my bus back after 10 months of being in the garage and I think that the clutch release bearing is knackered. It always made a whining noise when I depressed clutch but now the whining is there as well as an awful grinding/clack clack clack sound (there's also another nasty noise when cornering - can't be related?) and the clutch pedal judders. It happened very suddenly when changing gear - so suddenly that I just thought it was the clutch cable or something.

A few notes: It will drive and even goes into gear without crunching. The noise continues while driving but goes at a certain amount of revs. Just a horrible sound underneath. Like a clack clack clack.

You can actually feel the vibration underneath the front cab under your feet. No nasty noise when in neutral.

The clutch cable was just replaced by a local garage.

The clutch release lever seems to be vibrating a lot.

The gearbox fluid could also be low (replacing was the next job actually).

Does that sound like the release bearing? I thought so but need to order parts and I live in Spain so would appreciate a second opinion. If so, can anyone tell me which kit I need? Figured 200 mm. Never dropped the engine before but willing to have a crack and I'm too skint to take to garage.

It's a US 68 bay which I think has the OG gearbox but has a twinport engine from, I believe, a 73 model.

 

[StuF]

Yep sounds like the release bearing to me - when you split the engine from the transmission it will be clear
Bet it's worn badly

 

[StuF]

Hopefully when you look in the bell housing you won't see this




New pressure plate required



Some broken bits - notice the release bearing and where the arm has snapped off



Mine made a brief noise before destroying itself - more details here and the repair although eventually I went for a late bay bearing, pressure plate and guide.

 

[admwllms]

Thanks, pics are really helpful, gonna have a read of your thread, vaguely remember reading about you doing it now actually. Might try and get away with just the release bearing cos I've just dropped thousands on various things lately and trying to save money at the moment but will probably need one of those kits with pressure plate etc, reckon its likely buggered.

Never dropped the engine or done anything this big before, should be an experience!

 

[StuF]

It's easy mate - one of my small tricks is to drop the engine off the moustache bar holding it with the jack and lower it enough so you can reach the top two bolts on the engine/gearbox. Remove them, lift engine back up, axel stand under gearbox and remove the two bottom bolts and the engine will slide straight out.

 

[admwllms]

Ugh more issues! These things always seem to happen when I'm beyond broke, might have to take it off the road for a bit and get another car to tide us over.

So, I followed StuF's advice and changed the clutch bearing, pressure plate, etc. It was the first time I'd dropped the engine but took it dead slow and it went great. Don't wanna say it was too easy but yeah, no big deal.

Anyway, so have been driving around for a couple of weeks with no issue, changing gears great, everything running smoothly when I got stuck in heavy traffic today and there was a grinding noise and the clutch pedal drops to the floor. ****.

Pull over and theres too much slack in the clutch cable for some reason despite being tightened. So I botched it with some bolts and tightened it again and the bus makes a horrible grinding noise then stalls if you try and put it into gear.

I'm wondering if the gearbox is knackered, though all was working absolutely great to that point. Anyone got any thoughts? I know that's a bit vague to diagnose a fault, gonna take a better look tonight when the sun eases off (I'm in Spain) and will update if I can find out more.

I've got a spare clutch cable but honestly not sure that'll help much as it's pretty tight now. The only other thing I noticed is that it seems like the spring in the arm that the clutch cable joins to is broken even though clutch pedal did return fine.

 

[admwllms]

Actually, I'm talking crap, it stalls if you even push down the clutch! Here's a video my wife shot


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t2WE3wiyvd8&feature=youtu.be

 

[georgeyv]

That sounds rough!

There are a few components in the clutch that can fail - gveee has just has a part snap underneath and cause him a load of grief. I'll direct him to this thread and see if he can shed some light on it.

 

[Moseley]

It's got to be clutch related again, that's a horrible noise when you press down on the pedal! Can't be gearbox as you were in neutral whilst taking that video. I'm not sure what could be causing that much resistance when pushing the pedal to actually grind and stall the engine, but I'd be looking at the entire clutch itself.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[admwllms]

Thanks gents, good point with the neutral Moseley, and yeah it's a bloody awful noise isn't it! From nowhere too, didn't have any slipping, noise or anything until right that moment.

I got one of those clutch kits from Cool Air including the Pressure plate, Friction disc and Release bearing, so hopefully those aren't broke as they're only 3 weeks old. I guess I'll get my dad up on thursday to help me pull the engine again and see what's what.

At least we were lucky and broke down in an absolutely beautiful spot underneath some palm tree shade and a literal stone's throw from the beach. That took a little of the sting out of breaking down on our first proper day out in the bus for over 10 months, though we have been using it for shopping and various errands.

 

[ozziedog]

Before you go crazy with it, it sounds like the pressure plate has self destructed or come un bolted but I've not heard anything like that before. I was wondering if you could take a load of pictures with your phone through the gaps around the thrust bearing release arm and see if you can blow it up on your iPad or pc to see what you got. Possibly if the thrust bearing wasn't installed exactly, or the retaining clips weren't just so, something has maybe let go and got between the pressure plate and the driven plate and caused an issue. If you are in neutral, it shouldn't theoretically be possible to stall the motor with the clutch unless you are not in neutral and there is something else going on.

Ozziedog,,,,,,,,,,, absolutely certain it's in neutral?

 

[admwllms]

Ozzie I think you might well have something here. I forgot when posting, I guess because I was stressed, but during the install the one thing I wasn't happy with was the clips on the thrust bearing. I even called in my dad for help and a second opinion as he's installed a few over the years (though not on VW's).

In the end we checked out a lot of websites, youtube videos, etc and the general feeling was it was okay but it just felt flimsy to me, like they didn't grab well enough. Once all worked okay I forgot all about it but I wonder if the heavy pressure of using the clutch a lot in bad traffic was enough to shift them or something similar like that. The sounds it was making were similar to when the thrust bearing originally went.

Tried taking some pics underneath but can't seem to get anything good, probably doesn't help that my phone is smashed so on an old smartphone at the moment. Oh and I'm as sure as I can be that it's in neutral unless something really weird is happening with gearbox. It does start and ticks over so can't see it being in gear?

I've already dismantled all the outer tinware, etc and my dad is popping round to give me a hand pulling it out tonight, will update and post some pics if I get anything done tonight,

 

[admwllms]

Well, the thrust bearing was actually in correctly, as far as I can tell because it was still locked in position with one clip but the other one snapped :shock: It appears that this caused the thrust bearing release arm to foul against the pressure plate and make all that noise/nastiness/stalling.



A few questions:

What could have caused this? Don't want it to happen again - just ****** flimsy clips maybe? Bad luck or me installing it crap?




How the hell do you replace the bearing release arm? Can't seem to tell from looking at it.

See the scoring on the pressure plate? Reckon this will still be okay to use or do I have to buy another? It was the top quality one and bloody expensive!



Also there's quite a bit of oil in there, assuming a seal has gone and that's not normal...

Cheers

edit: oh **** it looks like I might have the wrong kind of pressure plate and thrust bearing installed, this is the late kind I believe? And I think I have the early kind of gearbox and forks for the thrust bearing.

I just copied the exact kind that was already in there but maybe the firm that installed it for me back in Wales did it wrong too...

 

[StuF]

Can you post a pic of the gearbox bellhousing?

 

[admwllms]

Dammit, thought I had, my bad. That's not exactly how it was as we had a fiddle with it but close enough. Let us know if this isn't clear enough and I'll take another. Pretty sure it's the wrong type now I've looked into it...


photo album upload