Earlybay forged dropped spindles?

[TransporterHaus]

Is anyone at all interested in 68-70 drum or 71-72 M12 caliper dropped spindles for their bus?

I'm interested to hear peoples thoughts on whether they'd use them if they were available as a new forged spindle.

 

[*Sam*]

Yes defiantly, I could get away from the reverse ball joint and keep the 3.5" drop making the ball joint replacement much easier

 

[TransporterHaus]

Yes defiantly, I could get away from the reverse ball joint and keep the 3.5" drop making the ball joint replacement much easier

You can't go more than about 60mm, roughly 2.5" on a regular dropped spindle or things start to foul. With a reverse ball joint they would be 6" drop.

 

[*Sam*]

Ahh ok, I guess that is the same as the French slammer stuff ? (2.5")

 

[TransporterHaus]

Ahh ok, I guess that is the same as the French slammer stuff ? (2.5")

Yup, any more and the shaft fouls the ball joint area and probably fouls the rim too. French Slammer / Empi copies semi forged are 58mm

 

[K@rlos]

I've recently fitted some French slammer stuff for a friend, brilliantly made BUT increase the track.

 

[*Sam*]

Ahh ok, I guess that is the same as the French slammer stuff ? (2.5")

Yup, any more and the shaft fouls the ball joint area and probably fouls the rim too. French Slammer / Empi copies semi forged are 58mm

Well in my book yours would be my choice then as I defiantly wouldn't want to widen the track width.

 

[Moseley]

I'd have thought if the quality was good and the price is right, then they've got to be a better option than the modified versions that are currently available. No disrespect to your items and others available, but the ability to use standard ball joints and keep the same width of track would be a big plus point. I presume they would work out cheaper than manufacturing cut and welded / flipped ball joint spindles anyway?


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[TransporterHaus]

Ahh ok, I guess that is the same as the French slammer stuff ? (2.5")

Yup, any more and the shaft fouls the ball joint area and probably fouls the rim too. French Slammer / Empi copies semi forged are 58mm

Well in my book yours would be my choice then as I defiantly wouldn't want to widen the track width.

There's a reason why the track is increased. Without it the spindle fouls the rim. So if I make them they will have to increase the track to avoid rim fouling. It's not much only 5mm a side.

I'd have thought if the quality was good and the price is right, then they've got to be a better option than the modified versions that are currently available. No disrespect to your items and others available, but the ability to use standard ball joints and keep the same width of track would be a big plus point. I presume they would work out cheaper than manufacturing cut and welded / flipped ball joint spindles anyway?

What in your opinion is a right price? In the short term they don't work out cheaper as the cost of the forge tools and initial machining setup is not cheap.

 

[Graham L]

To be honest the increase in track on the currently available ones hardly makes a difference as these always work better if you go narrower at the same time. You can fit 2.5" drop spindles to a standard beam but due to the design of the front wheel arch inner section you have to be very careful of tyre sizing or they will rub.

On a 71/72 spindle theres also an issue with caliper location, going lower means the caliper has to move.

We've looked at creating early forged ones and had the conversation with Christophe at Vintage Autohaus but the quantity required to make it affordable just didnt stack up unless you can quote better Alex?

 

[TransporterHaus]

We've looked at creating early forged ones and had the conversation with Christophe at Vintage Autohaus but the quantity required to make it affordable just didnt stack up unless you can quote better Alex?

Graham, I agree about the track, it's nothing. I can get them done no problem and have a design ready to go. They'll never be the price the late ones are currently going for though!

 

[Graham L]

We've looked at creating early forged ones and had the conversation with Christophe at Vintage Autohaus but the quantity required to make it affordable just didnt stack up unless you can quote better Alex?

Graham, I agree about the track, it's nothing. I can get them done no problem and have a design ready to go. They'll never be the price the late ones are currently going for though!

Wasnt expecting they would be (cheap Empi repros)but happy to have a conversation regarding quantity and prices if you are up for it, always want to stock the best product available.

 

[Moseley]

I'd have thought if the quality was good and the price is right, then they've got to be a better option than the modified versions that are currently available. No disrespect to your items and others available, but the ability to use standard ball joints and keep the same width of track would be a big plus point. I presume they would work out cheaper than manufacturing cut and welded / flipped ball joint spindles anyway?

What in your opinion is a right price? In the short term they don't work out cheaper as the cost of the forge tools and initial machining setup is not cheap.

Well the current market options are all around £500 - but I'm aware that some of this cost takes into account that the trailing arms also need modifying to fit the dropped / flipped spindles. Would new, forged units negate the need to modify the trailing arms?

Also, what benefit are there to forging over the like of WagensWest / French Slammer? I'm not using this as an excuse to rip into other people's work, but am just interested to know the differences between each option. Given a price, people will make their own judgement on which option suits themselves the best. It's certainly of interest to me as I'm looking at buying a full narrowed beam and dropped spindle setup before the sunny weather arrives again.

 

[Graham L]

I'd have thought if the quality was good and the price is right, then they've got to be a better option than the modified versions that are currently available. No disrespect to your items and others available, but the ability to use standard ball joints and keep the same width of track would be a big plus point. I presume they would work out cheaper than manufacturing cut and welded / flipped ball joint spindles anyway?

What in your opinion is a right price? In the short term they don't work out cheaper as the cost of the forge tools and initial machining setup is not cheap.

Well the current market options are all around £500 - but I'm aware that some of this cost takes into account that the trailing arms also need modifying to fit the dropped / flipped spindles. Would new, forged units negate the need to modify the trailing arms?

Also, what benefit are there to forging over the like of WagensWest / French Slammer? I'm not using this as an excuse to rip into other people's work, but am just interested to know the differences between each option. Given a price, people will make their own judgement on which option suits themselves the best. It's certainly of interest to me as I'm looking at buying a full narrowed beam and dropped spindle setup before the sunny weather arrives again.

Trailing arms don't need to be modified to fit 2.5" dropped spindles, they do for flipped spindles.

Benefit is they are cast as a single unit rather than using cut and welded originals which the WW & FS ones are but thats the only option at the moment.

 

[Moseley]

Trailing arms don't need to be modified to fit 2.5" dropped spindles, they do for flipped spindles.

Benefit is they are cast as a single unit rather than using cut and welded originals which the WW & FS ones are but thats the only option at the moment.

What is it you're referring to in your FS adverts when you say 'modified lower arms' being supplied with the entire front end setup? Sorry, slightly deviating away from the original post.

Are the FS dropped spindles just a cut and welded original set, or is the actual stub a new item?

I had THaus flipped spindles on my old van, and whilst they worked spot on combined with coilovers, I did have the fear over what it would be like to press the old BJ's out should they ever need replacement. The FS setup looked to be the option I take, but the idea of cast spindles is an attractive one if I'm honest.

 

[Graham L]

The lower arms are modified at the suspension mount but only on an 11cm (4") beam set up to allow correct angle for the dampers and to stop the lower part of the damper fouling the beam bolts. This is why most companies only offer a 3" narrowed beam. They are not modified at the balljoint end.

The FS like the WW dropped spindles use an existing backing plate fitted with a new stub axle thats welded and pinned through both parts, these have never failed and both FS and WW have been selling these for years. Cast ones will look better and it would be interesting to see wheher or not they will increase the track as the current late bay ones do increase the track in the same way the early dropped spindles do. Its to do with thickness of the casting where the stub axle sits.

Sorry Alex for this running off Topic but some of the points being made are valid,

 

[TransporterHaus]

Clarifying one point Graham made. Not cast they need to be forged. There is a lot of difference between the different techniques and the costs involved. Cast is not suitable for a bus spindle due to strength issues of the material.

 

[Graham L]

Clarifying one point Graham made. Not cast they need to be forged. There is a lot of difference between the different techniques and the costs involved. Cast is not suitable for a bus spindle due to strength issues of the material.

OK Alex, my bad I meant forged not cast :msn4: :msn4: