Sharing my frustrations

[Resto-raider]

Hi Guys,

I'm getting fed up with my van. I've been having trouble for over a year now with the engine cutting out. I've tried evertything and have replaced everthing. I have no clue where to look anymore.

The problem is that at some point when the engine is warm it starts to stutter and a bit later it just stops. This an be after 20 miles like yesterday or after 100 miles or...any moment is possible! The engine won't rev anymore as if it runs out of fuel. Sometimes it starts back up again, but won't rev, sometimes it doesn't start at all anymore. If I wait for say an hour and a half all is good again and it starts and runs perfect. If I then stay off the motorway it will probably keep running. So far the problem only occured on the motorway, so at speeds of 60-65 mph.

I've had the problem again yesterday. I wanted to testdrive it for a trip of 150 miles to make sure everything is allright to go to Busfest and it failed on me again after 20 miles. It usually takes longer to kick in. This means that I won't be able to take the van to Busfest because I won't even make it to the Ferry and I have no time to look into the problem and test it since I'm going on a holiday.

What have we replaced to try to solve this issue:
- New 1776cc engine (not really to do with this issue)
- 1-2-3 electronic ignition
- Cleaned the gastank and coated it
- Checked the breather hose on the gastank.
- replaced old worn carb for a professionally refurbished carb 34pict3 (modified to bigger venturi etc to match bigger engine)
- New mechanical fuelpump
- Changed the fuel lines to 8mm
- Swapped the fuelpump for an electric fuelpump with shut-off relais.
- Changed the coil while broken down on the hard shoulder

While broken down I've checked if there was spark, there was. I checked if there was a vacuum in the gastank so took of the gas cap. No hishing sound and problem not solved. I looked as if no fuel got to the carb thats why I changed the fuel pump for a new one. Still not solved so mounted bigger fuel lines and an electric pump last week. I was sure it was solved as I drove it 160 miles back and forth to Luxemburg up some pretty steep motorway slopes. No issues at all.
Yesterday it failed on me again. My brother towed my off the motorway and because at that time the engine was stone cold again I managed to drive it home no problem at all staying off the motorway.

It still sounds like a fuel issue to me, but I can hear the fuelpump running, the gas tank was filled up to the max and there seemed to be no vacuum in the tank. The only thing left to try is the ignition block that might heat up, but as far as I know this only causes the bus to not start anymore.

Anyone have any ideas and will you still let me camp at the Early Bay plot at Busfest with my Watercooler?
I'm so dissapointed right now!

 

[gvee]

What happens when it dies? Is it a sudden loss of power or does it cough and splutter a bit?

What electric pump are you using and at what PSI? How is it wired up?
If you crap out again try bypassing your relays and what not and run the pump directly off the coil for a short while (not a permanent solution!).

 

[Resto-raider]

When it dies I first notice it sputters and then I start to lose power pretty fast and it won't pull anymore. So a pretty sudden loss of power. It gives me just enough time to find a spot to park it and then all power is gone. The engine eventually stops running as if it is all out of gas, but after a few minutes will start again but will not rev. A few more minutes later it will rev and I can drive it for half a mile without any noticeable problem until the same ritual starts again and I have to stop once more.

I don't think it is related to the electric pump or relais itself because this was only installed last week and I've been having the exact same problems with the mechanical fuel pumps that i've had installed before. We figured the inlet fuel line was too small and a little gas bubble started to block the pump, but now that we've changed all the lines to 8mm this sure can't be the problem anymore.

The electric fuel pump is wired to stop when the alternator light comes on I think, but this was done by an experienced professional.

 

[StuF]

When your engine stops is the carb cold? Might be suffering with carb icing if it only does it a higher speeds?
Are you running the standard airfilter?

 

[Resto-raider]

I haven't felt if the carb is iced. I don't think it is but I will check next time it occurs. I am running the stock oil bath air filter and I have working preheats. I especially bought a good condition original manifold with open preheat pipes to prevent icing of the carb.

 

[StuF]

I suppose one way to check if it is a fuel or electric issue is to pop the fuel pipe to the carb off when it cuts out next and get someone to turn the ignition over whilst you divert the fuel pipe into a bottle checking for a good squirt of fuel into the bottle.

No fuel could equal pump/electrical issues
Good fuel flow from the pump could point to the carb

 

[gvee]

I am starting to wonder if something is getting a little too hot... coil? Again, check the temperature of this when it next happens.

 

[bibbo]

I had a similar problem on a Volvo 30 years ago, turned out it was a crack in the winding in the alternator. Very unpredictable, could be 10 miles could be 100. When it was diagnosed I had done 430 miles with no probs.
More recently had a problem on my Bay in Europe. It was the rivets on the electronic ignition plate loose in my brand new distributor.

 

[weeboll]

have you changed the HT leads as well as the coil? and also all the other little wires of known and unknown function (if your engine is anything like mine)

sounds like a heat related electrical fault especially if your confident your fuel delivery is working ok. something is stopping it rev when hot

 

[Resto-raider]

Thanks for all your input, I really appreciate it.

I changed the coil while stranded on the side of the road yesterday. I use an aftermarket heavy duty 'Blue' Bosch coil and swapped it for a proven OG Bosch one that I used before. Problem not solved.

I have not tried to change the leads while stranded, but did change them some time ago, so the problem occured with the old and the new leads.

Most electrical wires in the engine bay have been renewed, but not the ones going underneath the bus to the front.

I should have checked if the pump deliverd enough fuel to the carb, but I forgot. I will do next time to make sure.
I should also check if the carb has fuel by removing the air filter tube and see if it squirts fuel in when I pull on the accelerator.
It would probably be good to make a checklist for when I break down, but I prefer to solve the problem and never encounter it again because this way there's no telling when it will happen. And it's no fun going anywhere.

The alternator is fairly new and tested, but I don't see how this can be related, because the van can run without a working alternator/generator as long as the battery is up to it. (I've driven it for quite a few miles with a broken generator with the old engine). Also, the alternator light doesn't come on until after the engine has stopped on the hard shoulder.

Honestly i'm not confident about the workings of anything anymore. All I know is that when it runs it runs perfect and strong.

 

[stokeseys]

i am having similar issues, but mine is just a stock 1600. however, i was researching YouTube for remedies. one video was about vapour lock whereby the heat of the engine was causing a problem to the fuel in the lines and filter. the chap rerouted the fuel line over the fan housing and added a loop to prevent air getting into system. also put fuel filter at back if engine to allow to keep cool!!

 

[norm]

Hello
Have you checked mixture is correct sounds like it could be running lean
When you conk out has it been on a constant throttle for a long time ?
Does it do it when you have been on and off the throttle ie in traffic
Something else to think about !!
Norm

 

[Trikky2]

I should have checked if the pump deliverd enough fuel to the carb, but I forgot. I will do next time to make sure.
I should also check if the carb has fuel by removing the air filter tube and see if it squirts fuel in when I pull on the accelerator.
It would probably be good to make a checklist for when I break down

You have given yourself some good advice :mrgreen:

 

[Resto-raider]

This is advice that I picked up from you guys and my engine builder.

The engine isn't running lean as far as I know. The plugs have the right color and the mixture was set with the help of a CO meter. The guy that built and tuned the engine really knows his stuff and we've been going through all the little detials to try and find out what causes this.

The vapor lock was what we thought, that's why we changed the lines from 6mm to 8mm, installed an electric pump and ran the lines over the cooler tin. Also, a (plastic) fuel filter should never be in the engine bay because it is a fire hazzard. Mine is situated underneath the tank. Another thing to check for next time (note to self) is it still holding fuel or is it empty?
The pump is also underneatht the tank so no direct heat from the engine to affect it.

When the engine stops I've usually been driving on the motorway at constant speeds.
I've not had this problem when on and off the throttle in traffic.
But I'm not sure what I can conclude from this. Help me understand please.

 

[stokeseys]

Ive just checked mine and fron what i can see the clips on fuel line onto the filter were too tight and effectively squeezed the fuel filter causing a restriction of fuel

 

[Tristan71]

Could the problem be more electrical maybe ignition key switch breaking down for good measure clean all your fuses up and check the condition

 

[jonboylaw]

Which fuel pump did you fit. There is a section pump and a push pump. Push pumps are fitted near the tank, suction pumps are fitted near the carbs.
If you have a suction pump mounted by the tank with a large head to the carbs then you could be getting fuelling problems.


Sent from my GX64 SatCom phone using Tapatalk

 

[Resto-raider]

I haven't driven the van for a few weeks now, because of the vacation and the fact that I can't go anywhere if there's an end-time attached to it because I never know if I will make it or not.

However, tomorrow my mechanic and I are going to pick up a Diesel engine he bought about 80 miles from here. We are going to pick it up with my van so we can hopefully reproduce the problem and he can do an analysis when the problem occurs. We are taking all kinds of spares and tools. Hopefully we will find it tomorrow and we can figure this out for good.

If we find it i'll let you know what the problem was.
If not I'm installing the engine from my recently bought Type 181 Trekker to see how that goes.

 

[Clem]

Interesting , I know of a van with just this problem. Coil, carb, leads, plugs, points and condensor have all been swapped with no improvement. We removed the tank, flushed it, cleaned the internal filter and replaced all breathers, fuel lines and added a new in line filter with no joy. Absolutely drawn a blank with it. :?

Wierd thing is, he fitted a motorcycle fuel tank in the spare wheel well as a temporary measure and when using that there were no problems at all .... but after what we did to the proper tank etc it just makes no sense. When we disconnect a fuel line at any point petrol pisses out so there are no feed problems or restrictions.

Like you, the owner has lost all confidence in the van and cant really use it.

 

[mattd1984]

Do you have an external oil cooler + fan fitted?