1776 Engine

[kmangion]

It's now time for me to start building up the engine for my 72 baywindow.

Parts list he has so far:

AS41 case,standard size bearings (machined for full flow)
90.5 barrels
Stock balanced 311 rods
Lightened flywheel and balance bottom end 69mm crank,8 dowel.
2x40 Italian Weber IDF Carbs
Meling high flow oil pump
Oilcooler and filter
Stock heads and valves
bugpack 1.25 ratio rockers
Engle 110 cam
009 distributor with Petronix Ignitor 2
Petronix Flamethrower 2 Coil

Any suggestions if this lot would be OK for a reliable motor and with some performance for when its needed.

It would be greatful to hear what you all think.
Thanks in advance.

 

[dubdubz]

go for counterweighted crank and yes fully balance crank assembly

get heads worked over instead of rockers - ie mild port/clean up and 3angle job on valves

go vac dizzy always on a bus

and you shouldn't need an external cooler if all std cooling bits are intact and correctly setup, full flow will assist in longer oil changes.

I'd also double check the lightened flywheel - seem to recall a std one albeit balanced is better in a heavy bus?? not so sure on that

all imho of course [you did ask :lol: ]

 

[360andi]

I'd also double check the lightened flywheel - seem to recall a std one albeit balanced is better in a heavy bus?? not so sure on that ]

^WHS^
A standard flywheel will help with torque (just what's needed in a heavy bus). A lightened flywheel has less inertia and so you get less torque.

I'll give you an example. In the early 90's we converted many 250cc two-stoke Motocross bikes to Enduro spec. MX requires the motor to rev and spin up fast. Where as Enduro motors require torque and grunt. The biggest gain in grunt and torque (which also equals more traction) was the addition of a weighted flywheel.
Hope this helps.

 

[cunning plan]

Great thread, watching arty0051:

 

[angus]

Likewise - following with interest!

 

[Araon]

yeah you'll need that big lump of iron to keep momentum especially on take offs.....your pushing a big weight when compared to a bug or type 3 especially in camper dress......

funny but my reference again is bike related, ducatis often people lighten the flywheel great acceleration from the L twin when motoring the pick up is brilliant but through traffic, at lights and junctions what a bitch just keeping the motor alive its a bigger fight than ever

if you lighten the flywheel you'll probably need to compensate by enriching the fuel mixture and as said reworking those heads atleast, just flow and polish the heads you'll get more for your money

 

[young_dubya]

Im building a simlar motor in the near future, got price for the buts from JMR and they are VERY cheap compared to everywhere else. Counterweight crank 69mm is £190!! Rods up to 150bhp £95! Try him befor eyou go anywhere else.

Mines a similar spec but engle 100 cam for more low down torque and standard rockers for the minute. Standard flywheel for better torque, slightly slower acceleration but the grunt is what you need in a heavy vehicle. Im also going to have John Maher port polish and semi hemi cut the heads which should make everything nice and balanced and also free up some more horses from the carbs and zaust.

Ash.

 

[easy]

go for counterweighted crank and yes fully balance crank assembly

get heads worked over instead of rockers - ie mild port/clean up and 3angle job on valves

go vac dizzy always on a bus

and you shouldn't need an external cooler if all std cooling bits are intact and correctly setup, full flow will assist in longer oil changes.

I'd also double check the lightened flywheel - seem to recall a std one albeit balanced is better in a heavy bus?? not so sure on that

all imho of course [you did ask :lol: ]

Excatly what you need to know :mrgreen: nice reply dooder :mrgreen:

 

[kmangion]

i guess, i built some interest here

so you do not suggest me using the 110 engle cam and the 125 forged rockers?

this is my first build and what i've learned was threw this precios forum!


thanks in advance

 

[maddog]

I'd also agree with not going down the 'lightened flywheel' route as said in the above replies.......but i would say a 110 cam is good personally.....and ideal 'all rounder'.

Good luck

 

[Trikky2]

I would agree with the above. Also - careful how big an oil pump you fit. Too big and it will only eat power for no gain and tend to blow the oil filter on cold starts.

 

[Matt_B]

With building a good strong 1776 such as this would any gearbox mods be required?

Not so much from the point of view of it being able to handle it, as I'm sure it would be fine, but with the extra torque being produced would upgrading to a different gearbox produce better motorway cruising?

 

[dubdubz]

most do forget gearbox's, but is the essential next step to getting the best out of the larger cc build.
There are several companies that will build you a box with a 'longer' fourth, so mway cruising is easier. Cogbox, VWSpeedshop to name a couple. I have a speedshop gearbox but can't yet comment as I haven't tried it!
a popular if increasingly exensive option is a 2ltr gearbox swap, relatively easy if you get the right one, but these are fetching big money these days [like the GT boxes on bugs]

It is best though [as with an engine build] have in mind what type of driving you are going to do, and what your wheel/tyre combination is out back...also you may need to get the speedo recalibrated on that note........


to the original PO, the 110 is ok if you have already bought it the 100 is an upgrade over stock and again keeps the useable rev range power where a van would want it. And yes I wouldn't bother, yet at least, with the rockers unless you have got them already. Depending on the rev range you anticipate bolt up std ration rockers might be good insurance [but this does depend on your cam choice]
GAC apparently get loads out of std heads as does John at JMR,in fact I can't recommend him enough. Does and charges what he says he will and imo knows his onions......

 

[alex4057]

I run a 1776cc

admittedly it was professionally built rather than me doing it, I run a lightened flywheel, and as most will tell you it's no slouch of the line, i tend to beat most, but i do rev the tits off it! I'm also using a engle 140 cam which is a much wilder animal!

I would say HEADS are where everyone neglects to spend the money/have the work done, and this is where all your power is made, any engine is basically an air pump so the more air and fuel in and the bigger and the cleaner the path for the exhaust the more power created! I run a worked set of CB 044 heads and they are (along with my lairy cam) why my engine does so well for it's little size!

I'd go for a Bosch Blue Coil rather than the flame thrower, I've known a few of them to fail

Go for the remote Oil Cooler and Filter, it add's a fair few litres of oil to your system and really helps keep things under control on those long journey's mine sits at 70mph all day long even in the middle of summer!

Gearbox wise, the standard ratio's in the 091 6 ribbed box are excellent, i've seen 100mph (On a track officer!) out of my bay and it also now cruises much better than it ever did on my old 1600 box. The main upgrade in my gearbox is a 4 cog spider diff from a later syncro van, I mullered my first one doing burnouts at Action 2008!

Hope that helps!

 

[ob1]

I run a 1776cc

admittedly it was professionally built rather than me doing it, I run a lightened flywheel, and as most will tell you it's no slouch of the line, i tend to beat most, but i do rev the tits off it! I'm also using a engle 140 cam which is a much wilder animal!

I would say HEADS are where everyone neglects to spend the money/have the work done, and this is where all your power is made, any engine is basically an air pump so the more air and fuel in and the bigger and the cleaner the path for the exhaust the more power created! I run a worked set of CB 044 heads and they are (along with my lairy cam) why my engine does so well for it's little size!

I'd go for a Bosch Blue Coil rather than the flame thrower, I've known a few of them to fail



Go for the remote Oil Cooler and Filter, it add's a fair few litres of oil to your system and really helps keep things under control on those long journey's mine sits at 70mph all day long even in the middle of summer!

Gearbox wise, the standard ratio's in the 091 6 ribbed box are excellent, i've seen 100mph (On a track officer!) out of my bay and it also now cruises much better than it ever did on my old 1600 box. The main upgrade in my gearbox is a 4 cog spider diff from a later syncro van, I mullered my first one doing burnouts at Action 2008!

Hope that helps!

Just outta interest is the 002 2l gearbox better than the 091 for race performance?

 

[K@rlos]

yeah you'll need that big lump of iron to keep momentum especially on take offs.....your pushing a big weight when compared to a bug or type 3 especially in camper dress......

funny but my reference again is bike related, ducatis often people lighten the flywheel great acceleration from the L twin when motoring the pick up is brilliant but through traffic, at lights and junctions what a bitch just keeping the motor alive its a bigger fight than ever

if you lighten the flywheel you'll probably need to compensate by enriching the fuel mixture and as said reworking those heads atleast, just flow and polish the heads you'll get more for your money

The Ducati (which are sex on wheels as far as bikes go) flywheel thing is oh so true. World rally cars have lightned flywheels and when they idle its really irratic and lumpy due to this but they launch like a bullet coming out of a gun.

 

[alex4057]

I run a 1776cc

admittedly it was professionally built rather than me doing it, I run a lightened flywheel, and as most will tell you it's no slouch of the line, i tend to beat most, but i do rev the tits off it! I'm also using a engle 140 cam which is a much wilder animal!

I would say HEADS are where everyone neglects to spend the money/have the work done, and this is where all your power is made, any engine is basically an air pump so the more air and fuel in and the bigger and the cleaner the path for the exhaust the more power created! I run a worked set of CB 044 heads and they are (along with my lairy cam) why my engine does so well for it's little size!

I'd go for a Bosch Blue Coil rather than the flame thrower, I've known a few of them to fail



Go for the remote Oil Cooler and Filter, it add's a fair few litres of oil to your system and really helps keep things under control on those long journey's mine sits at 70mph all day long even in the middle of summer!

Gearbox wise, the standard ratio's in the 091 6 ribbed box are excellent, i've seen 100mph (On a track officer!) out of my bay and it also now cruises much better than it ever did on my old 1600 box. The main upgrade in my gearbox is a 4 cog spider diff from a later syncro van, I mullered my first one doing burnouts at Action 2008!

Hope that helps!

Just outta interest is the 002 2l gearbox better than the 091 for race performance?

I've only run a 1600 box (not sure of it's proper code) and the 091 6 ribbed 2L box, With the 1600 i had to use all 4 gears with the change into 4th being not far from the 1/4mile mark, I also found it tended to bog down a little after the change into 4th, but with the 091 box i only use 3 gears which seems to have done my times the world of good. My P.b. on the 1600 box was a 17.5 and my P.b. now is a 16.7 using the 091 box, Not sure if that answers your question or not?

I know the 091 6 ribbed casing is the strongest and hence why quite a few drag beetles run them now

 

[ob1]

Cheers Alex, will let you know how i get on. :mrgreen:

 

[alex4057]

My Pleasure, we have quite a possy of vans coming from Norway to Big Bang to enjoy some Santa Pod RWYB ACTION

If your about come say Hi, and bring your van, More the merrier

 

[ob1]

My Pleasure, we have quite a possy of vans coming from Norway to Big Bang to enjoy some Santa Pod RWYB ACTION

If your about come say Hi, and bring your van, More the merrier

Yer chat to a few of em, think u were at scc with em. Big bangs what im aimin for think im gonna be in my 75 bay as im not gonna have the sc done(time ) Puttin the 1776 in the 75 next month then gotta run it in, once ive decided on carbs, any recommendations? gonna run 1776 with a 002 2l box as reommended by the norwegiens,gonna try it see how it goes.
Im hopin to run under 30secs!lol n not go bang at big bang.