Engine upgrade parts

[billybradshaw]

Afternoon folks.

I've just managed to convince my GF that putting my engine in the dining room to work on is a good idea. Afterall I said 'it'll only be in a few days whilst I change some seals and stuff' :lol:

Anyway, I couldn't resist taking the heads off and I was greated by a load of oily gunge in three of the four chambers. I've decided that the heads are pretty lame and and that the barrels / pistons have seen better days.

I tempted to buy some CB Performance 044 heads, new forged pistons with barrels (sticking with 1600) and a set of 1:25 ratio rockers again from CB. This lot will be complemented by twin 34ICTs and stainless exhaust.

http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=77
http://www.cbperformance.com/catalog.asp?ProductID=114
http://www.vwspeedshop.com/store/product.php?productid=16487&cat=392&page=1

Would this little lot be a worthwhile purchase or should I save my coin and stick with more run of the mill stuff?

Any opinions would be appreciated.

Cheers

Ian

 

[VWAIRCOOLED]

Thats going to cost a fair bit.It will improve things a bit,but the most improvements will be by fitting a better carb system and increasing cc's,why not spend a little more and go for bigger cc's whilst you're there? You'll need to think about carbs as well,unless you've already got something good?

Edit,like the twin ICT's that you have (after reading the post properly)

 

[pete nice]

Gas flow the cylinder heads as that's where the main restrictions are. 044's could do with work too, they are not great out of the box. The bigger valves will reduce torque slightly. You would be better with a good flowed pair of 040's with the 1.25 rockers. use these with the twin ICT's & it should work well.

 

[VWAIRCOOLED]

Pete,do you gas flow the heads yourself grinding bits that look like it will improve things or do you get it done at an engineers on a flow bench?

 

[pete nice]

I use GAC engines, http://www.vwracing.net If you go in with a grinder you can do as much harm as good. They recut the valve angle to increase flow.

They have a flow bench so can see the results.

Costs about £150 a pair to be done.

 

[speedwell68]

I use GAC engines, http://www.vwracing.net If you go in with a grinder you can do as much harm as good. They recut the valve angle to increase flow.

They have a flow bench so can see the results.

Costs about £150 a pair to be done.

I've got 040 heads that had already been done when I got the bus. I went for 1641 forged pistons and Dell'orto 34 FRD carbs and she flys and gives 31 mpg on a run. I have also got a 4 into 1 with a quietpack. The next upgrade is going to be electronic ignition and then the 1.25 rockers.

The Dell'orto 34 FRD is very similar to the Weber 34 ICT. Mine have vac ports for the dissy and they work really well with the stock vac dissy. If you can get them with vac ports do as a genuine dissy is a billion times better that a 009.

 

[billybradshaw]

Thanks fellas, right OK, 040 heads, what is the best source for these? Are there any good places oop north that you know of who could tackle the work?

I've considered the 1641 conversion but have been put off by reports of high running temps etc. Is there a conversion that avoids this or is it a case of running additional cooling, like deep sumps external fan assisted cooler?

Cheers

 

[pete nice]

If the engine is set up right it shouldn't run hot,

These so called overheats you can get with any engine with lack of maintainance. 1641's have been getting a bad press lately. There are hundreds pushing busses around all over the world. If they were that bad suppliers would not fit them to busses.

040's are common as muck, you can pick a good pair up from ebay, forums or a show. £30 each would be a fair price.

The Dellorto FRD's are a bit nicer than ICT's, but either would do. If you flow the heads you could get away with 36 IDF or DRLA's with 28mm chokes. They are bomb proof!

ICT's suffer from spindle wear, they don't last that long & can be a little crude.

Use a 0.55 idle jet in what ever carbs you choose...

 

[billybradshaw]

I'm new to the VW engine scene so please bear with me

What are the key differences between the 040s and 043s that I currently have? Also, if the heads are that kind of money I might be tempted to have a go at flowing the heads myself. Are there any guides out there describing what I need to aim for?

I've got a brand new pair of 34ICTs waiting to go on, I got them from CB performance and asked for them to set up for a bus, they've come with 1.35 mains and 0.60 idles. I planned to get my bus to a rolling road and have it set up, based on what you say I'll get some 0.55s in time for the session.

Cheers

Ian

 

[pete nice]

O.60's are too big really. 0.55's are the ones to use. the 135's will be ok for a 1600, but if you do some mods you might want to hop up to 140's. If you use a stock fuel pump get a pressure regulator too. The pump is strong & can force petrol past the needle valve & flood the engine.

DO NOT TOUCH YOUR HEADS!!! Either leave them stock or get them done properly. You can do as much harm as good. If you go mad you can scrap the casting. Engineers like GAC remove the valves & recut the angle for increased flow, this is not something you can do at home.

Trust me, it is money well spent.

The newer type of 043 has slightly smaller valves than the 040. The Buggy I did a conversion on recently used flowed 043's & it goes well, so you can use your old heads.

My 1776 was built with GAC 040's & that went like stink even with an Engle 100 cam. The compression was bumped right up to give it loads of power.

I am still using those heads on my 2007 build with the 100cam & 1.25 rockers. I have dropped the compression right down to run a turbo...

Small valves will not flow as much air but will flow faster so will make more torque, the engine will pull from tickover right up to about 5,500rpm, thats more than enough in a bus.

Speak to an engine builder & get some advice...

 

[speedwell68]

I agree about the over heating issues with 1641. Mine don't overheat, not even close. There seems to be a lot of paranoia about overheating these days. At lot of overheating comes through lack of servicing, incorrect timing and the incorrect use of 009s. IMHO.

 

[Guest]

if the heads are good past 15000 miles you can be pretty sure they will keep, and re-use them if you can. Get them flowed and build upon that.

 

[angus]

Cheers guys - interesting thread!
Quick question - Laurie Pettit or John Maher Racing! - or A. N Other I don't know about! Anyone any experience of such services (ie: people who will build and engine to spec, with vast experience and knowledge) PM me if preferred...ta!

 

[Guest]

have you thought about Richard Morena?

http://forum.earlybay.com/viewtopic.php?t=4735&highlight=richard+morena

Really nice guy genuine and easy to talk to and very helpful from my experience, his site http://www.morena.co.uk you'll only hear good things about him on here, there are several who have had him build their engines and hes closer to you i think. im not sure where hes located but someone could tell you possibly near bristol i think?

 

[angus]

Thanks Johnny - another website to drool and dream over!
Only mention the others as those are all I've heard of, so great to see other options!

 

[pete nice]

John Mayer is one of the best engien builders in the country. He has built hundreds of engines.

GAC build formula V race engines & get well over 100bhp from a 1300 singe port motor, they reve to over 7500 rpm on a stock crank!

VW Speedshop might build you a nice motor too.

Ring a few up & see what they say.

 

[billybradshaw]

Thanks for all the input fellas, much appreciated although my mind is now well and truely boggled with all the options that are out there.

Furthermore, I've just removed the pistons and checked the float of the con-rods on the crank. There is approx 0.3mm on each rod although rather worryingly this translates to approx 1.5 - 2.0mm at the piston end, err....is this within limits???

I've no history of the engine so no idea what sort of a life it's had and how many miles are on it except the 3000 that I've done since getting the bus. I'm kinda thinkin' that I should buy a new mexico engine and start again within a 'known' engine and slowly modify up from there. I'm concerned that I could bolt on the mods we've discussed only to be let down by a dodgy bottom end, etc (oo er missus)

Any views?

thanks again

Ian

 

[maddog]

Cheers guys - interesting thread!
Quick question - Laurie Pettit or John Maher Racing! - or A. N Other I don't know about! Anyone any experience of such services (ie: people who will build and engine to spec, with vast experience and knowledge) PM me if preferred...ta!

Ring John and ask him the questions.....he has a wealth of experience and is one of the top engine builders in the UK.
I've bought of him and recommend 100%.

 

[james_stan]

Furthermore, I've just removed the pistons and checked the float of the con-rods on the crank. There is approx 0.3mm on each rod although rather worryingly this translates to approx 1.5 - 2.0mm at the piston end, err....is this within limits???

Not quite sure what movement you're referring to here. If you get Wilsons book 'How to rebuild your VW engine' you get all teh wear limits to refer to. Also get Keith Seumes book on parts interchange (a bit outdated now but stilll a decent reference) and you will be able to formulate your own plan with some more information. Building your own should save a bit of money but will be time consuming for the first time unless you are an experienced mechanic

Alternatively you can just hand it over to a pro-builder or get a Remtec 1776 or similar.. This will cost 2-3K though minimum..

Cheers

James

 

[billybradshaw]

Evenin' James,

The movement of the con-rod is such that it can slide on the crank by about 0.3mm which is within limits, but, I can in effect 'rock' the con-rod such that I have approx 2mm movement at the gudgeon pin end.

Chek oot the pic, what y' reckon, fooked???

Cheers

Ian